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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Yes, and i year was suggested ... for
each infraction, defined as each stroke of the extractor; could be
hundreds a day...<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CAEXixT95uQtf7r-Gdkvq12qjA=kiJfNhncMv=zD0DkLmHFx6Dg@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">If it is a misdemeanor it is a sentence under 2
years....County jail time. If it is a felony it is any sentence
2 years and up in a State prison. Beth B. ex-deputy<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 24, 2014 at 1:23 PM,
Caitlin Alexander <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:caitlin29@gmail.com"
target="_blank">caitlin29@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div>I agree Karina.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
$10,000 per violation ($1,000 per really is chump
change for mega-oil)<br>
<br>
</div>
Maximum jail time as defined by state law (Vogel thought
it was 12 months per violation - we need to find out)<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>Vogel recommended both of these in conjunction not
and/or.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
Define the board members as specifically accountable for
these violations not just the "corporation".<span
class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>
</font></span></div>
<span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888">
<div>
-Caitlin<br>
</div>
</font></span></div>
<div class="HOEnZb">
<div class="h5">
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 24, 2014 at 1:13
PM, karinajoy <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:karinacotler@gmail.com"
target="_blank">karinacotler@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">You really think
it's worth passing an ordinance that allows a
judge to snub his nose at us by giving an
offender a $1/day fine? or probation? What kind
if disincentive is that? They could just come in
anyway and pay the puny fine. If we're going to
work our butts off gathering signature, don't we
want the ordinance to actually do it's job?<span><font
color="#888888">
<div>
K</div>
</font></span>
<div>
<div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Apr 24, 2014, at 12:57 PM, Baile
Oakes wrote:</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">I
will vote no on this.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Tim seems to agree.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>We have more than 11 people in
our organization.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>We do not have a process in
place to make a rush decision that
represents the will of the full
CRNMC. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
A lot of people think we are ready
to gather signatures.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>There is no definitive word of
how long the process of amending
will take.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Shannon still has not heard
back from Ben regarding this
matter.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>We need all the time we can get
to gather signatures.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>We have a good ordinance</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>A Great Step Forward</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>, not perfect, </div>
<div>
<br>
</div>
<div>what is ?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>let's move forward with
signatures and endorsements and
get going.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The clock is ticking</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>yep</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
Baile</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Apr 24, 2014, at 11:45
AM, karinajoy wrote:</div>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div
style="word-wrap:break-word">
<div>Want you to know, even
if we change sec.4, it may
add only a few days to our
process (they have 15
days, but I may be able to
speed that up, since the
title and summary will not
change). Everything else
is ready to move forward,
with the minor change to
the ordinance language -
the newspaper publication
is ready; the petition is
ready; the Letter of
Intent won't change. We're
ready to open the bank
account and file form
410. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The sooner we come to
an agreement, the sooner
we can start the clock
again. I am prepared to
drive to the county today
and resubmit the
Ordinance.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>So far out of 15
responses, 11 have been to
go ahead and change sec
4a. The other 4 did not
say no. Opinion on 4b is
50-50.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Anyone´else have a
strong opinion?</div>
<div>K</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div
style="word-wrap:break-word">
<div>On Apr 23, 2014,
at 11:52 PM,
karinajoy wrote:</div>
<div>
<div><br>
<blockquote
type="cite">
<div
style="word-wrap:break-word"><span
style="font-size:15px">Sisters and Brothers,</span>
<div
style="font-size:15px"><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size:15px">A
small but
crucially
significant
problem
regarding our
Ordinance has
arisen. It can
be solved if
we act now. It
will cause
some delay,
but it is
better we fix
the problem
now than
ignore it and
regret it
later.</div>
<div
style="font-size:15px"><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size:15px">It
has to do with
the
ENFORCEMENT of
the Ordinance.
In other
words, we need
to give our
Ordinance the
proper teeth
with which a
judge MUST
(not just MAY)
enforce the
Ordinance and
thus dissuade
those who
would break
the law.</div>
<div
style="font-size:15px"><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size:15px">Barry
Vogel pointed
this problem
out before,
but
then Norman de
Vall raised
the concern
again. And
Charles
Wood responded
with <span
style="font-size:medium">“I
don't think
that simple
use of the
word "offense"
makes it
unenforceable,
it just </span><span
style="font-size:medium"><b>gives the judge too much latitude</b> to set
the fine at
whatever level
he or she
pleases.<b> It
could be
$1/day. </b></span><span
style="font-size:14px"><span style="letter-spacing:0px"><font
style="font-size:15px"
size="3">The
jury decides
the facts
(guilty or
not-guilty), </font></span>Judges
interpret the
law (amount
for the fine).</span><span
style="font-size:medium"><b>"</b></span><span style="font-size:medium">
They all
agree, we</span> need
to be more
specific and
strong in the
enforcement
clause. </div>
<br>
<div
style="font-size:15px">So
this is
Barry's
suggestion, as
best I recall
: </div>
<div
style="font-size:17px">Sec.
4(a). </div>
<p
style="margin-top:0px;margin-right:0px;margin-bottom:6px;margin-left:0px;font:normal
normal normal
12px/normal
Arial;font-size:15px">
<font
style="font-size:17px"
size="3"><span
style="letter-spacing:0.0px">Any corporation, government or natural
person that
violates any
prohibition of
this Ordinance
shall be
guilty of a</span><span
style="font-family:arial,sans-serif"> most serious misdemeanor offense </span><span
style="letter-spacing:0.0px"> and, upon conviction thereof, shall be
sentenced to </span></font><span
style="font-size:17px">go to prison for one year and shall </span><span
style="font-size:17px">pay a fine of $10,000 for each violation. Each
time the pump
is turned on,
and each
stroke of the
pump down and
up shall be a
separate
violation, and
violation of
each section
of this
Ordinance
shall count as
a separate
violation.
Courts shall
grant no
probation.</span></p>
<div
style="font-size:16px"><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size:16px">Is
there any
strong
opposition to
this change in
sec.4(a)? The
lawyers at
CELDF (or you)
may fiddle
with the
language or
the fine, but
we need
agreement by
tomorrow, so
we can
re-submit
asap.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>On a
second issue:</div>
<div>Sec. 4
(b) shall we
strike out "or
any resident
of the County<b><i> "
and later "or
the
resident..."
?????</i></b></div>
<div><b><i>Bus
and Prof Code
17200 recently
took away the
citizen's
right to take
enforcement
action. Ben
felt we should
claim this
right anyway,
since it's
just another
slow erosion
of our rights.
But Barry
thinks we
shouldn't risk
the ordinance
over this.
So, should we
leave it in or
take it out?</i></b></div>
<div><b><i><br>
</i></b></div>
<div
style="font-size:16px">There
will be a
cost. We'll
have to pay
the $200 fee
again (which
is refunded
when we
qualify for
the ballot).
But we'll
forfeit the
first $200.
And there will
be some delay.
But since I
doubt it will
change the
title or
summary, it
could be a
fast
turnaround. </div>
<div
style="font-size:16px"><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size:16px">Let's
do this right.
A little
additional
cost, a little
delay. The
hurry isn't as
great as the
need to get it
right and have
a strong
ordinance.</div>
<div
style="font-size:16px"><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size:16px">So
shall we make
the change to
4a? and keep
or delete
citizen
enforcement in
4b?</div>
<div
style="font-size:15px"><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size:15px">Karina</div>
<div
style="font-size:15px"><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size:15px"><br>
</div>
</div>
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<br clear="all">
<br>
-- <br>
<div dir="ltr">
<h1 style="text-align:left"><span style="font-weight:normal"><font>"The
trouble is that once you see it, you can't unsee it. And
once you've seen it, keeping quiet, saying nothing,
becomes as political an act as speaking out. There's no
innocence. Either way, you're accountable.”</font></span>
<font><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/6134.Arundhati_Roy"
target="_blank">Arundhati Roy</a></font>
</h1>
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